In last week's show, we discussed loneliness as “the other pandemic.” This week Kevin and Niseema welcome Kate Walter, author/essayist /journalist/educator, whose new book, "Behind The Mask: Living Alone in the Epicenter," takes us inside daily living in New York City during the pandemic. Her essays reveal her neighborhood, her neighbors, their isolation and fears as well as their strength and resilience as a community.Kate credits the power of writing as helping to cope and keep her sanity. We share some examples of writing prompts in the book that help you reflect on and clarify your own experiences during the pandemic. A natural extrovert, Kate talks candidly about how she found herself feeling isolated and alone in the most populous city in the US, and how the long haul of seclusion changed her as a person.
In last week's show, we discussed loneliness as “the other pandemic.” This week Kevin and Niseema welcome Kate Walter, author/essayist /journalist/educator, whose new book, "Behind The Mask: Living Alone in the Epicenter," takes us inside daily living in New York City during the pandemic. Her essays reveal her neighborhood, her neighbors, their isolation and fears as well as their strength and resilience as a community.
Kate credits the power of writing as helping to cope and keep her sanity. We share some examples of writing prompts in the book that help you reflect on and clarify your own experiences during the pandemic.
A natural extrovert, Kate talks candidly about how she found herself feeling isolated and alone in the most populous city in the US, and how the long haul of seclusion changed her as a person.
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For more information or support contact hosts Kevin O'Donoghue LMHC or Niseema Dyan Diemer SEP at: info@thepositivemindcenter.com, or call 212-757-4488.
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Thank you for listening,
Kevin and Niseema
www.tffpp.org
https://www.kevinlmhc.com
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Hi everybody. This is Kevin O'Donoghue, licensed mental health counselor,
33s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
And I'm Niseema Dyan Diemer, trauma specialist and licensed massage therapist. And this is The Positive Mind
39s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Where we bring you some ideas, concepts, and guests to help you lead a more positively minded life. And, you know, last week we introduced a concept of loneliness and loneliness as the other pandemic that's been going on. You know, we shared some statistics, pre-pandemic, 40% of Americans reported feeling lonely within the last six months. You know, back in the seventies, it was only 11% of Americans claimed to be lonely within the last six months. What do you think it's up to now after the pandemic pre-pandemic 40%?
1m 20s
Kevin O'Donoghue
What do you think about now, 70 65, 70? Have you felt lonely during this pandemic? We think it's the other pandemic. And a lot of statistics are going to come out about the loneliness factor in this pandemic. And we were so glad that, we were privileged to be sent a book by Kate Walter call Behind The Mask. And after I read it, I thought she'd be a great person to have on the show. She has a new book coming out in November, that's called Behind The Mask, Living Alone in the Epicenter. And I want to welcome her to our show Kate Walter, welcome to our show.
2m 5s
Kate Walter
Thanks for having me.
2m 7s
Kevin O'Donoghue
And it is the epicenter isn't it ?
2m 10s
Kate Walter
Well it was at the beginning when I started the book, it certainly was. New York City was the epicenter.
2m 16s
Kevin O'Donoghue
In what way was it the epicenter?
2m 18s
Kate Walter
Well, that's where the virus really landed first and the New York City area was I believe the hardest hit back when things first started here in the states. Yes.
2m 29s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yes. And you compliment both the governor and the mayor many times throughout the book or at least a few. Do you think they did a good job?
2m 37s
Kate Walter
I don't think I mentioned the mayor too much. I did think the governor did a good job when we were in the throws of it. I mean, of course we know, unfortunately he left in disgrace, but at the time I did think he was doing a good job. Made me feel like he was really looking out for me.
2m 53s
Kevin O'Donoghue
And one part of the book, you were so jubilant about getting the vaccine. Did everything change for you once you got the vaccine?
3m 2s
Kate Walter
It was an enormous sense of relief. I went to the Javits center, which I believe was the largest vaccination center in the country. It was really run well. They had the New York State NationalGuard there. It was like a precise military operation. I mean, I thought I was very impressed with how it was run. And I felt I was practically crying when the nurse put the vaccine in my arm the first time because I felt, oh, I'm not going to die. I'm going to live.
3m 28s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yes. Yes. Well, we want to take you through the book. We want to talk a lot about this before and after and during, you know, because we, we did a whole show last week on loneliness and your book struck me as a woman who was really stripped of all of her social connections, social context. I know at one point in the book you say from March to June 1st, I had contact with two people, social contact with two people in 2020. And it just struck me, is that typical? Do you think of many residents here in New York city?
4m 5s
Kate Walter
I don't know if it was typical. When I say contact, I meant like a sit down and have a conversation, hello, in the hallway or on the sidewalk I had a lot of that. I don't know if it was typical. It was typical for me because I'm single, I live alone. I had this fabulous social life before the pandemic, before the lockdown and had completely crashed. And I also live in a building Westbeth artists housing, which had tons of social activities. We had a community room, there was a gallery, there were concerts, thare were readings, there were openings, there were tons of things going on every week. So it was the perfect place to be if you were a single woman. And I had lots of friends, I went out with and did stuff with and that all just completely went away.
4m 49s
Kate Walter
So I was really kind of alone in my apartment with my Zoom and my writing.
4m 55s
Kevin O'Donoghue
And you mentioned a number of meltdowns you had in the book. You said there was one where you were listening to some music "you're welcome in this place," that song you're welcome in this place.
5m 9s
Kate Walter
Middle Collegiate Church. And another tragedy that happened during the pandemic was that it burned to the ground in a six alarm flop fire. So that just added to my sadness because we're, we're on streaming and we're thinking, oh, we can't wait to get back. And then the church burns down, but this was before the fire I believe. It was just this music you're welcome in this place. And it reminded me so much of being in this warm, loving, sanctuary, surrounded by great people and I was just like home by myself and I just started sobbing and it kind of shook me up. I didn't really expect to be so taken back. I just put my head down on my desk and I was sobbing because I was just thinking about how much I had lost and how much I wanted to be in that church.
5m 50s
Kate Walter
And here I am home alone on my computer.
5m 54s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
But in some way it sounds like the song and hearing that music and being in contact helps you feel that feeling of the community there with you.
6m 4s
Kate Walter
Right. Right. And I didn't have any problem with breaking down and crying cause you know, I've been in therapy a really long time and I feel like it's really important to feel your feelings, not to repress them. So if you're feeling sad, cry, right. And the other time I had a meltdown, I don't know if I was crying, but I really melted down was like, my computer went off and I was like, oh my God, this is my lifeline. I mean, I don't think Verizon's going to send anybody here in the middle of the lockdown so I was completely freaked out. And then another time my, my cell phone got heated up. So I was like, well, I'm glad I have a landline. And I did manage to resolve these problems. But it was like not having this technology in the middle of this lockdown.
6m 46s
Kate Walter
I was totally distressed.
6m 48s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
As you're talking, I'm almost kind of imagining it might've felt like somebody who was like in the wilderness somewhere.
6m 54s
Kate Walter
Right, right, right. I think this happened on two separate occasions if I'm not mistaken, but right around the same week, first, my Verizon went out and then luckily I just, you know, on unplugged, and said a prayer and then came back and then my cell phone, my 15 year old grand nephew gave me some advice as to how to get it back up.
7m 14s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Well, you know, I'm having a hard time imagining you being sad. You know, you have such energy. This is the first time we're meeting each other.
7m 24s
Kate Walter
That's the whole thing. I am like Miss Sociability. I mean, I'm a very social person. I'm the kind of person who can go to a party and talk to strangers. I like going into crowds. I'm not the least bit shy. I'm very chatty. I love conversation. So that's why it was so hard for me because I thrive on people interaction. And that was just stripped from my life live interaction in person.
7m 48s
Kevin O'Donoghue
You say that in the book that I am an extrovert. And so, you know, for our audience, what is an extrovert?
7m 55s
Kate Walter
I think an extrovert is someone who likes mingling with people. And I was a teacher for many years and I thought being an extrovert was a good trait to have because it made me feel comfortable in the classroom interacting with a lot of different people.
8m 10s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yes. I think it's very necessary to be an extrovert as a teacher. If you're an introvert as a teacher, you have a hard road to go because introverts introverts the difference between extroverts and introverts, introverts get soothing by separating and pulling away and replenishing themselves. Extroverts get their soothing by being with people by, by rejuvenating through people.
8m 31s
Kate Walter
I mean, I like solitude too. I mean, I'm a writer and I was perfectly happy living alone, but I needed that charge of interacting with people and that was just taken away.
8m 42s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
Well, I think we, we talked about this a little bit during the pandemic. We were, we were, you know, doing shows and how the pandemic affected the extroverts and the introverts. Extroverts had a hard time with this because for exactly why you say, but the extroverts were really struggling and it, you know, it makes sense that, that you would have the meltdowns that you did because it's like you're used to being able to be with other people.
9m 8s
Kate Walter
Okay. And I mean, Zoom is fine. It was good. We had that. But I mean, for example, one of my great joys was being in the same group that met in the community room every Friday. I love being in this group. I look forward to it. We sang, we danced, we had a great teacher, a great piano player and then gone. And then we did do it on Zoom. But you know, you really can't do music on Zoom. So here I am sitting in, standing in my apartment, singing by myself, it was like, but you know, I went just to see the people cause I liked everybody. But the first time we went back to the community room, which I think was end of July, it was just such a joyous thing to be back there, singing in person.
9m 49s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Are you at now? I mean, how are you around people now? Are you totally a hundred percent comfortable?
9m 55s
Kate Walter
Well, I'm not sure how to answer that question. I mean, I don't really eat inside. I did once, but I mean, I prefer to eat outside. You know, if I'm around people who are vaccinated, I'm comfortable.
10m 7s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Okay. You're not wearing your mask everywhere or are you?
10m 10s
Kate Walter
When I go to the supermarket now, I do with the Delta variant. I mean, that was, that was a big change. I was away for a few weeks in the summer. I came back at the beginning of August and I was like, oh, I better put my mask back on in the supermarket. And we still have to wear a mask in my building and the elevators that's never changed. Right. But I don't wear it when I'm walking around on the street or anything or outside. No.
10m 34s
Kevin O'Donoghue
So how about a chronology of everything that was missed, everything you lost going into the pandemic. How were those first weeks?
10m 45s
Kate Walter
Well, okay. The first week. Well, I can, well, I mean obviously, well my groups went away, I'm in a writing workshop that met in someone's apartment. Well that went away and went on Zoom. The singing workshop went away and went on Zoom, my yoga class that met in the community room that went on Zoom. And then I guess it really kind of hit me more with the first holiday, which was Easter, okay. And I come from this like big Catholic family that we always get together on all the holidays, Easter, Christmas, Thanksgiving. And this was like the first Easter I would have to say in my entire life that I wasn't with my family.
11m 26s
Kate Walter
So that was really hard and really sad. But then my sister sent me this audio tape, I forget which MP3 or something of my niece who has a gorgeous voice and she was singing like an Easter hymn and I think I started crying when I heard that it was like, this is the day the Lord has made. I'm going to start crying now. It was just so beautiful. And I thought, oh, I'm not with my family. And it was so sad. And I was thinking about what we'd be eating. And I would go out there with and put the Easter eggs in the yard. My sister has a ton of grandkids that we plant the eggs and hide them. And then there'd be an Easter egg hunt and then it'd be a big dinner and I'm here home alone in my apartment. You know?
12m 6s
Kate Walter
So the holidays were very sad, you know? Cause I always spent it with my family.
12m 12s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yeah. We wonder from our listening audience, how many people's holidays were totally changed. I think everybody's holidays
12m 20s
Kate Walter
Christmas, totally,
12m 21s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
Totally changed all the Jewish holidays.
12m 24s
Kevin O'Donoghue
July 4th, every holiday. Yes.
12m 26s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
I remember it being a very, it was just very quiet and very, it was a very sad time. I mean, people were just hanging tight.
12m 36s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Now you've been in therapy you say, you mentioned it a number of times in the book. And at one point your therapist says the whole pandemic is about loss.
12m 48s
Kate Walter
Yeah. She's the voice of wisdom. I mean, she's in my other book too. This is my second memoir then Dr. R she was even a bigger character in that. And in this basically, well, she was in an antidote to the loneliness too and validating my feelings. But also she was really great about interpreting these pandemic dreams that I had. I mean, she was always good at interpreting dreams, but I remember I had this one dream where I looked at, I was walking around the neighborhood in the East Village and in the, I guess was the East Village. And every building was on fire everywhere. I looked and I said, what's going on? And my therapist said, the fire is the pandemic. Like as if it was so obvious.
13m 28s
Kate Walter
And I was like, oh, you're right. It's all over the city. You can't escape it. And also the setting, which was interesting was right near where I used to see her. I used to see her in this office in like the East Village and it was right around there. So I thought that was interesting too.
13m 44s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Wow. Was there a time in your therapy when you really felt the loneliness?
13m 52s
Kate Walter
Throughout the whole pandemic. I mean, I don't think there was one particular point in therapy that was different than any other
13m 58s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Did you do Zoom sessions or in-person?
14m 0s
Kate Walter
Now. No. Well, we always talked on the phone. My therapist doesn't live in New York anymore, so that really wasn't any different. So I mean, I'm used to talking on the phone with her.
14m 11s
Kevin O'Donoghue
I see, I see. One of your other dreams was about a bridge.
14m 15s
Kate Walter
Oh, the bridge. Yes. The bridge was collapsing. Yes. And then, but I escaped and like I survived. Yes. It was about a drawbridge that was going up and my car was going to fly off it. Yeah. I said something about it was, it was, it was sort of a dream in like, I think the spring when we were starting to come back and she said, will we ever get to the other side? She always has these perceptive comments. You know, like, whoa, like the other side of the, the, the river, but the other side of the pandemic.
14m 44s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Well, that's a great question. I'm really wondering, but we're still wondering will we get to the other side? And when, if we, if we do, and then, and then there might be another one supposedly.
14m 56s
Kate Walter
That was one of the things about writing the book. I mean, it ended in may when, or beginning of June when things were really looking up. And then I had to add like a postscript because I felt like I needed to say something more because things weren't so rosy anymore.
15m 13s
Kevin O'Donoghue
We're talking to Kate Walter, the author of the new book Behind The Mask, Living Alone in the Epicenter, really about her journey through the pandemic, this two year journey year and a half so far. And we have a lot of chances, a lot of questions in the back of the book on page 110, 111, 112, the writing, the writing prompts. How did writing help you through the pandemic?
15m 44s
Kate Walter
Writing was my salvation. Let me just see, I had a few thoughts I wrote down about that. I mean, writing really helped me deal with the loneliness. I mean, I taught personally essay writing at NYU for about well, many years I maybe 30 years. So it's only natural that I would be writing about this because that's what I do. I mean, I keep a journal, I write personal essays, I write memoirs. So I started writing about what was going on. And I think the first piece, big piece that I published was about how the community room had closed at Westbeth artists housing. And that's like the heart and soul of this community. And that was like, oh my God, it's a ghost town here. It was, it was like a morgue and the lobby used to be jumping.
16m 23s
Kate Walter
And now we were told, you can only go down twice a week to check your mail. So it was like, I can't even go down to the lobby to talk to people. It was so upsetting. So I wrote about this and I published this piece in The Village Sun where I knew most people would be familiar with my building because it's pretty well known building. And then I just kept writing these essays for Lincoln Anderson, who was the editor of that publication. It's an online website. And then people started resonating with these liking these, the one melting down in lockdown. I got like 500 likes. And I was like, oh my God, I'm onto something. And so I just kept writing them and I felt like I was connecting with people. I was processing my feelings and it made me feel like a lot less lonely.
17m 6s
Kate Walter
And then eventually this led to the book.
17m 11s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Well, who or what did you miss the most when your life shifted and became more restricted? Oh, that family, friends, classmates travel, going to the local pub. Number two, that's number two. Who or what did you miss most when your life shifted.
17m 32s
Kate Walter
You're asking me to answer the question
17m 36s
Kevin O'Donoghue
I'm asking my co-hosts the same, Niseema you as well. I mean, and our audience, I mean, I think it's time, you know, for the audience to stop and reflect because these writing prompts at the end can really help people get in touch with their grief. I think there is a meltdown for many of us. I mean, I think the closest I came to was the feeling of wanting to run out of my house into the middle of the street and just say, come on already. That was, that was, I saw it in my mind's eye. I didn't do that. But I mean, I really felt like, come on already. And there was nobody to really say that to it was just the universe. I was trying to say it to, but that was, that was my version, but I'm sure everybody has had a version, some version of a meltdown.
18m 25s
Kate Walter
A breakdown.
18m 25s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yeah. You know, and now the resurging of the Delta variant and possible more, you know, I mean, this could be the time when people really feel like enough already, but so why don't we go around? Who or what did you miss the most when your life shifted and became more restricted? I missed seeing my clients in person
18m 47s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
that's what I was gonna say I missed the rhythm of coming into the office, seeing my clients, seeing the people here and, and even like seeing the people on the streets. It was such a bizarre experience to go out into New York City streets and have like nobody there. I was walking my dog, you know, there were times I would go and, and we, we talked about this when it was happening, but there's also a real importance. And I think it's why it's really important to have these writing prompts that we start to reflect on this experience a little bit, because everyone probably is feeling still some shock. I think there's still quite a bit of shock, some minimization of things, but I think that's a, it's a beautiful prompt.
19m 33s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
And I think it's important for us to drop into it like, what did we miss? What would he do that?
19m 37s
Kate Walter
Thank you. I mean, I think we really need to process this and writing is healing, and I think that's one way to do it. And maybe people won't pick up on all the prompts, but I figured 12, I don't know why I came up with 12, but I just realized my birthday is January 12th. So maybe in the back of my mind with some kind of numerology going on. First, I had 10, but then I came up with 12. So, but it helped me so much to write about it. I would like to offer that opportunity to other people with these prompts.
20m 6s
Kevin O'Donoghue
And how about it? Do you have friends who write as well? Have you shared these with friends?
20m 11s
Kate Walter
I haven't shared them with friends. No. I mean, when the book comes out, it will be shared of course. I mean, the book isn't out yet, but I haven't shared them. No.
20m 20s
Kevin O'Donoghue
I frankly think you could have some healing circles with these writing, with these, these writing prompts, because I think a lot of people have gone to sleep a little bit, you know, and that the writing prompts can bring people out into their own experience. Their memories might be fading a little from this pandemic. I mean, we have gotten a little sleepy. I mean, I, maybe I shouldn't generalize. I think I've gotten a little sleepy, but writing can certainly clarify your thoughts.
20m 49s
Kate Walter
And you can't bury this stuff as I'm sure, you know, as therapists, cause it's just going to pop up in some way or another. So it's better to address whatever needs to be addressed. And I think it's healing. And the other thing that you mentioned was 9/11 and the other thing I wanted to say is that, you know, I went through 9/11. I live in the village. I still have a whole horror from my rooftop. And I also went through Sandy. My building was devastated by Sandy because I live a block from the river. We were totally messed up for weeks, months, no electricity, no water, no elevator, no nothing. And, but what was different was that everybody came together, everybody was helping each other. We're carrying stuff up the stairs for our neighbors, carrying packages, doing stuff to help each other.
21m 34s
Kate Walter
And here we were like stuck in our apartments. I mean, I remember one time we got food donations from our generous city council person. And they had set up a thing where they were delivering the boxes to the community room. And it was so scary. It was like volunteers went down en mass and they said, they're going to ring your bell and then step back. And I was like, holy crap. You know, that they're going to so that they won't be there when I opened the door, you know, it was very nice that we got these boxes, but it was just so weird,
22m 7s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
So weird that like a lot was happening and you couldn't see it and you couldn't be in contact with it. Like things were still happening. You know, things were still going on and happening. And I think that, that, you know, the seven o'clock clapping and everything was our moment of, you know, being able to come together and feel each other.
22m 28s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Okay. Talk a little bit about that. Cause she mentioned that in the book and seeing neighbors across on a roof rooftops and this one family that you didn't think you'd liked because it was so priviledged.
22m 42s
Kate Walter
I'm looking out. I mean, I live in subsidized housing for artists. I'm looking out on these incredible townhouses that cost about $12 million that were built, you know, in the last, I don't know how many years since I've been in this building and some person, I mean, this is an entire family living in a house, okay. With a housekeeper. And it was like three kids, mom, dad, and the housekeeper in this big house. Okay. And on the roof, while all the playgrounds were closed in New York city, this guy built a private playground. He built a skateboard ramp, he had a ping pong table, later they got a hot tub. They had lawn furniture. It was like, I thought it was the ultimate in white privilege.
23m 22s
Kate Walter
And I thought, and then these poor kids can't even go to the park and his kids have a private skateboard thing on their roof. But then when we were clapping, we're all hanging out the window clapping. And then they all started clapping and the housekeeper started clapping and the whole family was clapping. And then I thought, well, maybe they're not so bad after all, you know, we're all in this together kind of thing. Yeah.
23m 43s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
We were all in it together, but we were all alone on a certain level.
23m 49s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yeah. Well, seven o'clock brought everybody together. Seven o'clock tell that's a seven o'clock ritual. We had that for probably two months that people came out at seven o'clock across the street from your apartment. There was a band that would play on Friday nights. They'd open their windows right on second street. Yeah.
24m 8s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
Yeah. On second street, there is a heavy, heavy metal band. Every so often I'm in the, I was, I used to be in the east village. I just moved. But yeah. Yeah, it was, it was remarkable. It was remarkable. And we'd hear, you know, different musicians would just, you know, open up the door and start playing their instrument. You know, it was great different.
24m 28s
Kate Walter
And there was another family
24m 29s
Kevin O'Donoghue
That was not in that
24m 30s
Kate Walter
And building, but in the building behind it also on 12th. And I think the people, the rich people were on Bethune street, but behind that on 12th street, there was this other family, never feel mom, dad, three little kids. And they drummed like mad and the mother had shakers and she had these shakers and the father and the little kids drummed like crazy. It was so fun and the kids were really into it.
24m 53s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
It also felt like a great sort of emotional release moment.
24m 57s
Kate Walter
You know, every night that family was out there.
25m 1s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
We all got to make some noise beause it was so very quiet, you know, at times, except for when the sirens were going.
25m 10s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yeah. So writing has been very important for you throughout your life not only as a teacher, but therapeutically, it seems yes. And these writing prompts will certainly do that. Here's another one. Did you have a point during the pandemic where you lost it or hit a wall? If so, when was this and what happened? You know, so if you haven't hit one, you might've gotten close. I mean, it doesn't have to just follow exactly the writing prompt, but I liked this part of the book because as I say, I do think it's therapeutic. I think it, it, it, it helps people see their grief, really realize and feel their grief.
25m 50s
Kate Walter
And if I'm not mistaken, it was Jennifer who I believe, you know, Jen, my publicist, I think she was the one who suggested the writing prompts if I'm not mistaken. So that was a great suggestion.
26m 4s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yeah. We have her for a reason.
26m 6s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
Yeah. It was a, it's a real, it's such an invitation for someone to drop into their experience and make it, get it, getting it out of you, you know, and putting it in sentences and putting it in, you know, a certain storyline, I think helps to organize it a little for, you know, for your system. I, I often suggest my clients write out things like just even, even if they don't seem to make any sense, just getting it outside of you helps you have a little bit of space and find where you are now
26m 40s
Kate Walter
In my therapy sessions, my therapist, because she knows I'm a writer, but like sometimes I'll say, I don't know. Don't know. I don't know. And she'll say, you know, you're not focusing. She said, I want you to free write on this and get back to me in the next session. So then we'll have to take that thing I'm saying I don't know about. And I'll have to free write for 10 minutes and see what comes up, right.
26m 59s
Kevin O'Donoghue
To see what you do know. We are here with the extrovert, Kate Walter, the extroverted writer. I mean, Behind The Mask, Living Alone in the Epicenter the book really does chronicle one woman's story about what she had and what went away and how she survived and how she felt about it. And these writing prompts in her I have to say your speaking styles is pretty shocking. Your energy level sounds so great. So terrific. And I think it's a real great temperament that you have. And, but the writing has, like, there is some sad passages and when we come back, I'd like you to read one passage about losses and you mentioned, and I think we could all chronicle our losses, you know, and one of the, one of the writing prompts again, number eight, were there any aspects of the pandemic lifestyle that you liked and will miss?
28m 4s
Kevin O'Donoghue
I liked my commute
28m 5s
Kate Walter
I heard a lot of people liked not having to commute. And
28m 9s
Kevin O'Donoghue and Niseema Dyan Diemer
I definitely liked that work. Yeah. Not having to commute and travel every day, not having to dress, etcetera. So we'll be back with Kate Walter. Her book is Behind The Mask, Living Alone in the Epicenter. You're listening to The Positive Mind. I'm Kevin O'Donoghue. I am Niseema Dyan Diemer and we'll be right back.
31m 49s
Kevin O'Donoghue and Niseema Dyan Diemer
And we are back I'm Kevin O'Donoghue licensed mental health counselor. And I'm Niseema Dyan Diememer trauma specialist and licensed massage therapist.
31m 56s
Kevin O'Donoghue
And we are here on our second show about loneliness the other pandemic. You know, I mean, can you tell somebody you're lonely? I did ask that the first show that lonely saying I'm lonely or the word itself is like a dirty word. People just do not feel comfortable admitting to it and talking about it, sharing it. And in the segment, Niseema and I did an exercize at the end of the last show on talking about loneliness and any difficult conversation, any difficult topic, especially if you're living with somebody who's close to you, that you can do that exercise that we demonstrated at the end of the last show on any topic.
32m 39s
Kevin O'Donoghue
But I think loneliness particularly is an awkward, difficult conversation to have.
32m 44s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
And there's a lot of stigma around loneliness and loneliness is a very painful experience. And we don't like to talk about pain. We don't know how we don't like to. It's it's pretty remarkable.
32m 58s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yeah. And the point is, but here's the thing. If you do not talk about difficult topics, do not talk about difficult feelings, avoidance happens and partners grow further and further apart, very, very subtly, very slowly, but that happens. And so the exercise we share with you at the end of last week show, you know, is a very simple way to talk about difficult subjects, difficult topics, difficult feelings that you have the energy now that I've gotten that out to, to live more live, better live like Kate Walter here with this energy, somebody who has been through the pandemic herself alone in an apartment here in New York City, getting ready to celebrate the 50th anniversary of her housing center, a big party, and what a relief for you to be living there.
33m 53s
Kevin O'Donoghue
You, we could talk a little bit about that, which way I guess we will. Most people don't live in New York city. Don't realize there is artist housing here in New York City and it's, it's, it's less expensive housing. And, and Kate was very excited about this 50 year anniversary coming up. And yet all the plans were shattered by COVID. So I wanted to start our second half Kate by you reading a little bit from the book, I'm talking about...go right ahead.
34m 24s
Kate Walter
Sure. This occur, this passage is towards the end. When I'm reflecting about what I went through, I thought about what I had lost this past year. I miss spending time and celebrating traditions with family and friends. I made a decision to leave my adjunct job, teaching personal essay writing at NYU. I love teaching this class, but I didn't want to teach remotely. And it was too stressful, not knowing what would happen in the future. So I retired a few years earlier than planned. I had just gotten my 30 year service award in the spring of 2020. I had a great run yet I felt sad to give this up. My program director and colleagues said how much they miss me.
35m 4s
Kate Walter
Fortunately, no one in my close circle of family or friends had died of COVID. Two friends and two relatives who had gotten sick all recovered at the beginning of the epidemic. Dean, a former student of mine died alone in his apartment in lower Manhattan. He didn't want to go to the hospital, a talented writer, an actor. I helped him find his voice and get his first pieces published. I was upset when I heard the news. A gay man Dean survived the AIDS epidemic, but died of COVID. A friend in New Jersey lost her mother in less than two weeks. I read the notices on the desk board in the mailroom to former tenants and to current Westbeth residents died of COVID all were elderly. One woman, a playwright and publisher wrote a farewell letter from her hospital room.
35m 49s
Kate Walter
As the temperature hit the sixties, I started eating lunch outside at the bus stop cafe.
35m 56s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Beautiful. There's a writing prompt right there. I thought about what I lost this past year. Just start right there.
36m 5s
Kate Walter
That's another one.
36m 6s
Kevin O'Donoghue
And then this, this playwright writing a farewell letter from her deathbed.
36m 10s
Kate Walter
Right? I don't think I knew her. I mean, I've lived in this building 24, almost 25 years, but she may have been someone who, I mean, the building has been around 50 years, as you mentioned. So she may have been someone who had moved out, you know, before I moved in, I don't think I knew her personally.
36m 29s
Kevin O'Donoghue
What do you think of that exercise as writing a farewell letter? I mean, I have to say, I mean, I frankly thought about writing a letter myself during COVID when, when it first hit and a lot of people were getting sick and the hospitals were overwhelmed. You know, I started thinking about my own mortality and I, I thought of writing something. I didn't get COVID thankfully, but I did think about it. And I thought, what would it be like for these people that their family can't visit them in the hospital. Right. And wanting to communicate to their loved ones before they go, what would you write?
37m 4s
Kate Walter
Well, I think she sent this to her family and then the family sent it to my building, to people they knew who were in the building, who knew her. I was surprised when I saw that on the buletin board because I mean, you see a lot of people pass away in my building. Someone will put up a picture and someone will write about them, but this was the woman herself writing about her own life.
37m 26s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Right, right. We, we, we had a guest once who wrote a book, Let's Talk About Death Over Dinner. And it's like the unspoken again, like loneliness. It is an unspoken topic. People do not talk about loneliness. People do not talk about their deaths. And even after COVID, it's still something people don't feel comfortable talking about. And so this gentleman wrote a whole book. He was a great guest talking about let's talk. And he planned his own funeral. And he went to his own funeral for his 40th birthday, his friends through a funeral for him. And he got to listen to all of their testimonials, all their memorials of him.
38m 8s
Kevin O'Donoghue and Niseema Dyan Diemer
He said it was the most touching and like beautiful experience of wow, for his life changing experience, life changing experience. So what, how did you change? I venture to say, I can't... Extroverts are hard to change.
38m 27s
Kate Walter
I feel like I, a lot of things that I took for granted, like just being able to go out to a movie or a play, I will never take these things for granted again, or being able to go out to a concert and hear live music. I will not take this for granted again. And I'm so grateful that some of this is coming back gradually in pieces. The other thing that I learned was that it would be nice to have a partner again. I mean, as I said, it was perfectly happy being single. I had sort of stopped dating. I was in a long relationship for 26 years that had ended a while ago. I'm gay. I wasn't really looking for anyone at this point, but then afterwards I thought, well, you know, maybe I should start dating again.
39m 8s
Kate Walter
I actually had a date this summer. I mean, I'm not, I don't have to be in a relationship, but I mean, I could see the downside of not being in one when I was alone in my apartment. The other thing I learned is that I'm very resilient. And I kind of knew that because my mother was, she lived to be 95 in good health all her mind intact. And I kind of feel like in some ways I, I must take after her. And I was really drawing on that resilience during the, some of the worst moments, like, you know, what would mom do in this situation? And she'd get through it, you know? So I get through it too.
39m 48s
Kevin O'Donoghue
the Irish are resilient, have resilience
39m 49s
Kate Walter
My mother was born in County Cork my mother, and she has this steely Irish resolve. That's what I say. And when Sandy wrecked our house at the beach, I mean, she was the epitome of Jersey strong. So I was like, I got to call that up when I'm in the middle of this lockdown.
40m 8s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
Right. I think, I, I imagine a lot of people have learned what you've learned that it's important to have relationships in your life, especially when things like this happen and things like this may happen again. And you know, if it's, if it's, you know, so many people got dogs, I had a dog during this, that I was really happy that I had that relationship to rely on, but I also was afraid if something were to happen to me, who would, who would come and take care of her. Right. You know, who would be there.
40m 37s
Kate Walter
Well, one thing that happened too, which is really like a good thing was I totally reconnected with like my best friend from high school. Okay. Now she lives in Arizona. She's also a college teacher. She was isolated from her family, her grandkids and kids all lived on the east coast. She's in Arizona. And, you know, we were emailing and she said, well, you know, maybe you'd like to talk. And I mean, we hadn't really talked. We saw each other at our reunion, but that was it. And as soon as we got on the phone, it was like, now I know why we used to talk on the phone every night in high school. And my mother would come into the room "are you two still on the phone?" And we would talk for like an hour, every Saturday hour and a half. And I, because first I thought, what are we going to talk about?
41m 18s
Kate Walter
It was just something about someone who knew me from when I was young and knew my whole family. It was just, she was like the best person to talk to. And she was so supportive and I felt so good after I talked to her. And it was, it was great that we renewed this friendship through the pandemic lockdown.
41m 36s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
I bet a lot of people did that. I, I think that's a wonderful thing. Reconnect with old friends, reconnect with family. You may not have connected with in a while. Like suddenly we all had time. Maybe, you know, if you'd lost her job or weren't, you know,
41m 53s
Kevin O'Donoghue
The subtitle of your book is living alone in the epicenter. What would you guess is the amount of people that live alone in your, in your complex, in Westbeth?
42m 2s
Kate Walter
Quite a few people live alone in Westbeth. yeah. I mean, there's a lot of older people. It's a norm, which is a naturally occurring retirement community. So, you know, as people get older, they lose their partners or they, they break up. Right. And you know, where the kids move out. I mean, there's a lot of people who have, you know, grown up children that don't live here anymore. And who, I would say a lot of people in this building are single, but not everybody. Of course,
42m 29s
Kevin O'Donoghue
I think next week I want to do the toll that loneliness and living alone can take on people and then the strategies people can use to get over loneliness. And one of the things, the, the army teaches us is ways to create, you know, cohesiveness in a group and how to avoid isolation and loneliness of troopers, the more lonely and isolated, the harder it is to get them to do what they need to do and they have a lot of techniques. I think I'd like to do that next week, bring in that data on ways to minimize loneliness, because there's a difference between isolation and loneliness.
43m 12s
Kevin O'Donoghue
And so when you lapse into loneliness, you there's physical cognitive effects. Long-term effects of being alone for a very long time and feeling lonely. So I think we should do a show next week on that.
43m 24s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
Well, and I think it's something also to bring up that here you are in a naturally occurring retirement community. It wasn't a plant. You know, it wasn't like people moved in to retire, but it, it sort of points out the, the, the necessity and the, the goodness of retirement communities, places where people can, you know, where there are activities where you can get together. And this was just such a strange situation to be having to isolate when you're in a community that's used to coming together to support each other. You could all be single and it's nice you have your own spaces, but it's so interesting that also there are so many older folks who resist to the, to their dying day to move into community with others.
44m 10s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
And there are many studies saying that loneliness is so detrimental to your mental health, your physical health, that it's, it's really important. You know? And, and I just want to shout out to some of, you know, anybody out there listening, who might be living alone and not knowing, you know, if they do want to move into a community or not, I would suggest they do.
44m 30s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Well, one interesting fact, and we'll, again, next week, we'll have more facts because I do want to go into this aspect of loneliness and being alone, is that the bigger the city, the less suicides, the smaller the city, the larger the suicides and rural communities have a higher rate of suicides than urban communities. So I think what you're saying is true. People learn loneliness, they learn isolation, they learn aloneness and the literature we're reading is talking about ways to unlearn that, things you have to do. Obviously, one thing is to put your cell phone down, to turn off your, your computer screen, to, to stop physically being isolated, to take a risk, you know, Oprah Winfrey, one of the things, and I'll bring this into next week.
45m 20s
Kevin O'Donoghue
She has a hello say hello group. That all you do is you say hello to people. So this is a way for even shy people to just stop being, being so lonely and isolated. How about your community? How is it coming back together?
45m 37s
Kate Walter
Well, it's coming back. The gallery reopened and I saw a wonderful sculpture show there yesterday. I mean, I had to wear a mask. I don't know what the opening was like, cause I wasn't here for that, but I understood they had drinks out in the courtyard as opposed to inside the room, which they would normally have, but it was a great show. And movie night is back at the community room. I think you have to wear a mask. I don't know. I haven't gone yet, but there are definitely activities in the community room. The gallery is open and things are coming back.
46m 12s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
And I'm wondering how you feel, how you feel in your body, how you, you know, like, was there a difference between when you were on your own and as you're starting to come back, like how your body is feeling?
46m 25s
Kate Walter
Oh yeah. I mean all those pandemic dreams. I mean, I wasn't sleeping good at all. And then there's a section in the book where in the summer of 2020, I managed to escape to the Jersey shore. Even though I was nervous about traveling. Once I got there, I felt like, oh, I can breathe. You know, I can sit outside, I can go to the beach. I don't have to wear a mask. And I slept so much better. As soon as I came back to the city in September, whenever I came back, the crazy dreams started, you know, it was just, I could feel the anxiety ratcheting up.
46m 57s
Kevin O'Donoghue
And you say in the book that at one point everything seems exhausting.
47m 4s
Kate Walter
Yeah. That was at the very beginning. When, especially when people didn't know about touch and you thought like, oh my God, if I touch the door knob or the elevator button, I mean, it was scary just to go shopping, to go to the supermarket. I mean, I got a little more relaxed when I realized that I wasn't going to get COVID from, you know, touching a door, but it was, you know, I would come home and I would clean the stuff. You know, how people were cleaning their groceries at one point. And it was just, it was exhausting. And I think I made a joke in the book that I said, I'm exhausted and it's only 9:30 in the morning Cause I had gotten up gone to senior shopping, all this stuff come back, waited for the delivery, cleaned it. And I'm like, oh my God, I'm exhausted.
47m 48s
Kate Walter
And it's like in the morning, still
47m 50s
Kevin O'Donoghue
uninteligable
47m 50s
Kate Walter
Thinking you're going to get COVID. That was exhausting.
47m 53s
Kevin O'Donoghue
So that's what it is. It sounds like a huge expenditure of energy through anxiety and worry. Not so much the activity itself.
48m 2s
Kate Walter
Right. I mean, going shopping is not very hard or draining, no.
48m 5s
Kevin O'Donoghue
And so we had a guest mind on mindfulness. What was her name again? Jen, Jen I don't remember her last name on mindfulness and it struck me that, she reminded me that COVID is a great time to have learned a mndfulness meditation technique, every step to bring mindfulness to. But I was struck by that in the book. Everything seems exhausting. And your therapist even noted it for you. She said, you're very tired. After a year she said you were very tired.
48m 33s
Kate Walter
Well also being on my own the whole time and taking care of myself on my own. It was really exhausting. Yeah.
48m 41s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yeah. What time do you get up in the morning?
48m 46s
Kate Walter
Me? Oh, I get up early
48m 48s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Oh I couldn't have guessed that
48m 49s
Kate Walter
It's 5:30 years without sending an alarm. I used to sleep a little later
48m 55s
Kevin O'Donoghue
But writers are supposed to be so depressed and down. You're so up and energetic.
48m 59s
Kate Walter
I'm on my computer at seven o'clock and I try and work in the morning and then I could be done at 12, you know, maybe do a little editing in the afternoon, but I do my best writing in the morning. Get up, have coffee, meditate, go to the computer.
49m 14s
Kevin O'Donoghue
So we don't have much time left. Kate. I thought I'd asked you to read another part of the book. How about the beginning? Westbeth feels like a ghost town. My life shut down. March 20, 2020
49m 30s
Kate Walter
Chapter one. The community room is closed. The gallery's dark. The spring flea market has been postponed the community room and the gallery are the heart and soul of Westbeth artists housing. Everyone looks forward to shopping at the busy flea market in the basement. The main lobby normally bustling with activity and conversation feels like a morgue. Management recently issued a memo that residents should only use the lobby for essential activities, no hanging out. I feel bad for the seniors with mobility issues who use the lobby as a place to sit on a bench and socialize, thankfully will get warm soon and they will be able to go outside into the courtyard. Westbeth is in Newark a naturally occurring retirement community with many seniors in their seventies and eighties.
50m 11s
Kate Walter
Whenever I go to the lobby to pick up my mail, I pass what my neighbor calls the death board, where people post a photograph or a notice of a resident who had just died. Suome ar expected, some are shocking. Two years ago, a friend, my age, a brilliant percussionist had a heart attack while walking in the park. I worry about how COVID will impact Westbeth. It's hard to believe that only two weeks ago, I gave a reading with three other writers in the community room. Over 50 people attended. I read the first chapter of a novel in progress and everyone told me they liked it and wanted to know what would happen next. We mingled and chatted and drank champagne. The feedback was super encouraging, just what I needed. It was the kind of interaction that makes Westbeth a great place for artists to live.
50m 58s
Kate Walter
I've been a resident here since 1977, I'm sorry, 1997. One of the best things about this complex is all the free and inexpensive activities that take place in the community room. Classes, readings, concerts, puppet shows for the kids under the auspices of the Westbeth artists residents council. I often write in my gratitude journal I'm grateful to live in Westbeth. Everything is now on hiatus. I love the chair yoga class on Monday taught by the gifted Jennifer Gibson, who trained at integral yoga Institute, it really helped me cure my sciatica. I totally looked forward to the same time sessions every Friday, taught by the talented jazz singer and Westbeth resident Eve Zanny. I've been a member of the bliss singers for over two years and made friends from inside and outside the building. At our last meeting on March 13th, we sat apart from each other, but sang our hearts out,
51m 51s
Kate Walter
She'd send us music videos so we could practice our repertoire at home. I think Raz our amazing pianist, dazzled us with his solos on Swing Swing Swing. We ended the session with a heartfelt, we shall overcome. I was almost crying when I said goodbye to my classmates with the now typical stay safe. As I left the community room I thought of that famous short story by Alphonse Jorday, The Last Class. It's a tear-jerker that made a big impression on me. When I first read it in college in a world lit class, especially since I have Alsatian ancestry. It's about the last class taught in French after the Germans took over the region called Alsace Lorraine. Now the virus was taking over my classes.
52m 34s
Kevin O'Donoghue
That's a slice of New York City, a slice of one woman's experience of living with COVID and shut down. The name of the book is Behind The Mask, Living Alone in the Epicenter by Kate Walter.
52m 49s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
So in hearing you recount all that, I imagine that a lot of people can relate that they're, you know, living in communities and everything shut down, everything stopped and everything felt like a morgue. Eventually, you know how it swept across the U S definitely here in New York City. It was a, it was a remarkable couple of days hearing the, the, the beginning of Broadway shutting down and then the, the events shutting down and all the theaters, everything, it was, it was wild. It was a wild time.
53m 25s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Yes. And everybody has experienced it in their own way. I think this memoir is a great introduction to your own grief. I think these writing prompts at the back of the book are really a great way, a great process for our whole family to do the writing prompts, to get in touch with what has happened, what happened? Do you know what happened? I sometimes I don't know what happened. I'm just bearing it, going forward, picking my feet up and carrying on, but I'm not sure really what has fully happened. So this book can really get you started to clarify what has happened for me. Again, the name of the book is Behind The Mask, Living Alone in the Epicenter by Kate Walter, our guest.
54m 4s
Kevin O'Donoghue
Kate, thank you so much for being here. I think this is going to be a bestseller. I think people are going to love this
54m 9s
Kate Walter
Thank you for having me. I hope it will become a best seller. It's coming out in November. November 16th is the pub date from Heliotrope Books.
54m 21s
Kevin O'Donoghue
This last writing prompt. Can you pick five words to describe your pandemic experience? Exhausting would be one of mine and that's going to do it for our show today. I'm Kevin O'Donoghue licensed mental health counselor
54m 32s
Niseema Dyan Diemer
And I'm Niseema Dyan Diemer trauma specialist and licensed massage therapist. And we'd like to thank our community radio stations that are bringing The Positive Mind to their listeners on a weekly basis.KACR KOSK KCSB. KPEJ KFOI KWSI KKCR KY GT. Also WBD Y WBTV, WRWK and Global Community Radio and The Detour. You can also find us on most podcast platforms under The Positive Mind. Thank you for your support. Also, our producer, Connie Shannon, our chief engineer, Geoff Brady. You can contact us at tffpp.org with questions, comments, or suggestions.
55m 16s
Kevin O'Donoghue